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	<title>Comments on: When location is everywhere</title>
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	<link>http://factoryjoe.com/blog/2008/05/05/when-location-is-everywhere/</link>
	<description>This can all be made better. Ready? Begin.</description>
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		<title>By: Nate Westheimer: 5 Things from the Future &#171; The Future: Today</title>
		<link>http://factoryjoe.com/blog/2008/05/05/when-location-is-everywhere/comment-page-1/#comment-99889</link>
		<dc:creator>Nate Westheimer: 5 Things from the Future &#171; The Future: Today</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 23 Jul 2008 22:53:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://factoryjoe.com/blog/?p=949#comment-99889</guid>
		<description>[...] friend Chris Messina wrote more about this, by the [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] friend Chris Messina wrote more about this, by the [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Defining information relevance for location based services &#171; Geographically challenged</title>
		<link>http://factoryjoe.com/blog/2008/05/05/when-location-is-everywhere/comment-page-1/#comment-99397</link>
		<dc:creator>Defining information relevance for location based services &#171; Geographically challenged</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 18 Jun 2008 12:14:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://factoryjoe.com/blog/?p=949#comment-99397</guid>
		<description>[...] services are all about. At this point in the evolution of the industry it&#8217;s still mainly about people and not so much the &#8220;things&#8221;. Maybe that&#8217;s because it&#8217;s human nature to [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] services are all about. At this point in the evolution of the industry it&#8217;s still mainly about people and not so much the &#8220;things&#8221;. Maybe that&#8217;s because it&#8217;s human nature to [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Dubroy.com/blog - Things to check out</title>
		<link>http://factoryjoe.com/blog/2008/05/05/when-location-is-everywhere/comment-page-1/#comment-99208</link>
		<dc:creator>Dubroy.com/blog - Things to check out</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 May 2008 00:00:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://factoryjoe.com/blog/?p=949#comment-99208</guid>
		<description>[...] When location is everywhere &#124; FactoryCity [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] When location is everywhere | FactoryCity [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Fade to Play &#187; Interview with Kate Imbach, Skyhook Wireless</title>
		<link>http://factoryjoe.com/blog/2008/05/05/when-location-is-everywhere/comment-page-1/#comment-99120</link>
		<dc:creator>Fade to Play &#187; Interview with Kate Imbach, Skyhook Wireless</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 19 May 2008 21:07:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://factoryjoe.com/blog/?p=949#comment-99120</guid>
		<description>[...] are a couple of posts on the topic of location awareness that I have read recently. The first is by Chris Messina and the second is by Todd Sieling regarding location and [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] are a couple of posts on the topic of location awareness that I have read recently. The first is by Chris Messina and the second is by Todd Sieling regarding location and [...]</p>
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		<title>By: gruvr live music map</title>
		<link>http://factoryjoe.com/blog/2008/05/05/when-location-is-everywhere/comment-page-1/#comment-98967</link>
		<dc:creator>gruvr live music map</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 May 2008 19:43:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://factoryjoe.com/blog/?p=949#comment-98967</guid>
		<description>Nice post, thanks.  I&#039;ve been coding GIS and spatial db systems since the mid-80s. 
The techniques of geolocation have been well known since well before the web (think Loran and terrain modelling), so it&#039;s surprising that more apps aren&#039;t using it even still. 

One common method of doing geolocation does really constitute a universal &#039;location-awareness&#039; layer as you put it: web apps can easily query an incoming IP for approximate coordinates, and do &#039;ip delivery&#039; to enhance the user experience.  

There&#039;s an interesting divide, though, between apps where the location information is really useful and those where it&#039;s merely an added interest.  Take news, for example - there are several sites which scout up hyper-local news and blog posts, but they dont seem to be gaining lots of traction: I might not be interested to read about the pothole repair 2 blocks away, all that hyper-local focus can end up introducing noise, as news needs to be filtered by interest primarily. 

Our site gruvr.com maps local concerts - it guesses where you are.  This is more useful because live music is opportunistic - the question of just how far away a concert is does matter, since you&#039;re trying to decide whether to actually GO there.

Regarding why geolocation hasnt been more widely adopted - There actually is a factor that those of us who are into geo-web apps know: you pay a severe penalty in terms of google SEO if you do geolocation.  
Why? Because most google spiders geo-identify as a user from Sunnyvale or Mountain View CA!

Thus, the google and adsense spiders think your site is all about the San Franciso scene, and serve those local ads... even to people in Boston!  Google can also penalize sites it thinks are doing cloaking, which is hard to tell from honest IP-delivery. 

The end result is that such  apps actually get penalized for improving user experience.
This is a sad state of affairs, an artifact of the text-based architecture of google&#039;s search technology.  It&#039;s limiting a lot of what can be done on the web, simply because google wasn&#039;t designed with knowledge of how geolocating apps often work.  

It&#039;s still a flat world, folks.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Nice post, thanks.  I&#8217;ve been coding GIS and spatial db systems since the mid-80s.<br />
The techniques of geolocation have been well known since well before the web (think Loran and terrain modelling), so it&#8217;s surprising that more apps aren&#8217;t using it even still. </p>
<p>One common method of doing geolocation does really constitute a universal &#8216;location-awareness&#8217; layer as you put it: web apps can easily query an incoming IP for approximate coordinates, and do &#8216;ip delivery&#8217; to enhance the user experience.  </p>
<p>There&#8217;s an interesting divide, though, between apps where the location information is really useful and those where it&#8217;s merely an added interest.  Take news, for example &#8211; there are several sites which scout up hyper-local news and blog posts, but they dont seem to be gaining lots of traction: I might not be interested to read about the pothole repair 2 blocks away, all that hyper-local focus can end up introducing noise, as news needs to be filtered by interest primarily. </p>
<p>Our site gruvr.com maps local concerts &#8211; it guesses where you are.  This is more useful because live music is opportunistic &#8211; the question of just how far away a concert is does matter, since you&#8217;re trying to decide whether to actually GO there.</p>
<p>Regarding why geolocation hasnt been more widely adopted &#8211; There actually is a factor that those of us who are into geo-web apps know: you pay a severe penalty in terms of google SEO if you do geolocation.<br />
Why? Because most google spiders geo-identify as a user from Sunnyvale or Mountain View CA!</p>
<p>Thus, the google and adsense spiders think your site is all about the San Franciso scene, and serve those local ads&#8230; even to people in Boston!  Google can also penalize sites it thinks are doing cloaking, which is hard to tell from honest IP-delivery. </p>
<p>The end result is that such  apps actually get penalized for improving user experience.<br />
This is a sad state of affairs, an artifact of the text-based architecture of google&#8217;s search technology.  It&#8217;s limiting a lot of what can be done on the web, simply because google wasn&#8217;t designed with knowledge of how geolocating apps often work.  </p>
<p>It&#8217;s still a flat world, folks.</p>
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		<title>By: 5 Things from the Future</title>
		<link>http://factoryjoe.com/blog/2008/05/05/when-location-is-everywhere/comment-page-1/#comment-98966</link>
		<dc:creator>5 Things from the Future</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 May 2008 12:30:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://factoryjoe.com/blog/?p=949#comment-98966</guid>
		<description>[...] friend Chris Messina wrote more about this, by the [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] friend Chris Messina wrote more about this, by the [...]</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: links for 2008-05-08 &#171; Breyten&#8217;s Dev Blog</title>
		<link>http://factoryjoe.com/blog/2008/05/05/when-location-is-everywhere/comment-page-1/#comment-98965</link>
		<dc:creator>links for 2008-05-08 &#171; Breyten&#8217;s Dev Blog</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 May 2008 11:31:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://factoryjoe.com/blog/?p=949#comment-98965</guid>
		<description>[...] When location is everywhere (tags: chrismessina factoryjoe geo location locationbased privacy) [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] When location is everywhere (tags: chrismessina factoryjoe geo location locationbased privacy) [...]</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Andrew Paterson</title>
		<link>http://factoryjoe.com/blog/2008/05/05/when-location-is-everywhere/comment-page-1/#comment-98964</link>
		<dc:creator>Andrew Paterson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 May 2008 10:32:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://factoryjoe.com/blog/?p=949#comment-98964</guid>
		<description>Chris,

Great article, as always.

I would add that &quot;location&quot; is going to be closely linked with the evolution of &quot;identity&quot;, meaning the proliferation of multiple identities (pro - leisure - perso etc.) as these identities will have different degrees of &quot;visibility&quot; attached to them which is going to make things particularly complex to manage both on the user side and the application side.

This is starting to become a real &quot;oignon&quot;...

Andrew ;-)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Chris,</p>
<p>Great article, as always.</p>
<p>I would add that &#8220;location&#8221; is going to be closely linked with the evolution of &#8220;identity&#8221;, meaning the proliferation of multiple identities (pro &#8211; leisure &#8211; perso etc.) as these identities will have different degrees of &#8220;visibility&#8221; attached to them which is going to make things particularly complex to manage both on the user side and the application side.</p>
<p>This is starting to become a real &#8220;oignon&#8221;&#8230;</p>
<p>Andrew <img src='http://factoryjoe.com/blog/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';-)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: Todd</title>
		<link>http://factoryjoe.com/blog/2008/05/05/when-location-is-everywhere/comment-page-1/#comment-98957</link>
		<dc:creator>Todd</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 May 2008 10:48:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://factoryjoe.com/blog/?p=949#comment-98957</guid>
		<description>...speaking of location based awareness. Here&#039;s Tom Coates running ( very quickly ) through FireEagle:

http://www.vimeo.com/962626

I found value in this video since he talks about apps I was unaware of that are already using FE and he outlines his wish list for what he would like to see people do with it.

Excellent post Chris. And I woul add that once Android is pervasive, and Google enables AdSense inside it, use of the location layer with increase rapidly. Commerce has to have an fiscal incentive - AdSense ads contextually relevant down to the meter is it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8230;speaking of location based awareness. Here&#8217;s Tom Coates running ( very quickly ) through FireEagle:</p>
<p><a href="http://www.vimeo.com/962626" rel="nofollow">http://www.vimeo.com/962626</a></p>
<p>I found value in this video since he talks about apps I was unaware of that are already using FE and he outlines his wish list for what he would like to see people do with it.</p>
<p>Excellent post Chris. And I woul add that once Android is pervasive, and Google enables AdSense inside it, use of the location layer with increase rapidly. Commerce has to have an fiscal incentive &#8211; AdSense ads contextually relevant down to the meter is it.</p>
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		<title>By: Andrew Turner</title>
		<link>http://factoryjoe.com/blog/2008/05/05/when-location-is-everywhere/comment-page-1/#comment-98946</link>
		<dc:creator>Andrew Turner</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 May 2008 00:00:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://factoryjoe.com/blog/?p=949#comment-98946</guid>
		<description>I would recommend anyone interested in Geo* come out to WhereCamp May 17 &amp; 18th on the Google campus. 

http://wherecamp.pbwiki.com/</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I would recommend anyone interested in Geo* come out to WhereCamp May 17 &amp; 18th on the Google campus. </p>
<p><a href="http://wherecamp.pbwiki.com/" rel="nofollow">http://wherecamp.pbwiki.com/</a></p>
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